Comments on: To Free Or Not To Free http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free gonzo phenomenology of virtual worlds, by dandellion Kimban Fri, 09 Jan 2009 20:51:52 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.7 hourly 1 By: Ghanima http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free/comment-page-2#comment-5808 Ghanima Wed, 08 Oct 2008 09:49:34 +0000 http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free#comment-5808 I almost did once, but I thought it over and I decided I was stronger than that ^^ I almost did once, but I thought it over and I decided I was stronger than that ^^

]]> By: dandellion http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free/comment-page-2#comment-5806 dandellion Wed, 08 Oct 2008 09:09:19 +0000 http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free#comment-5806 Please, please, please... don't let the few rude and ill-mannered sociopaths ruin your fun. Good communication is not dead, nor it will be. There are some people that have problems, there always will be. But never step back because of them. Please, please, please… don’t let the few rude and ill-mannered sociopaths ruin your fun. Good communication is not dead, nor it will be. There are some people that have problems, there always will be. But never step back because of them.

]]> By: Ghanima http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free/comment-page-2#comment-5802 Ghanima Tue, 07 Oct 2008 18:43:04 +0000 http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free#comment-5802 well I definitely agree with Dandellion on that one I must say... seems communication is dead and gone for a great number of residents these days and with that goes dead too the understanding that it is great to have fun but if you're rude and ill mannered just because you're free to do so (hiding behind a computer I must highlight), then you're ruining the fun for those who deserve it as much as you do well I definitely agree with Dandellion on that one I must say… seems communication is dead and gone for a great number of residents these days and with that goes dead too the understanding that it is great to have fun but if you’re rude and ill mannered just because you’re free to do so (hiding behind a computer I must highlight), then you’re ruining the fun for those who deserve it as much as you do

]]> By: dandellion http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free/comment-page-2#comment-5801 dandellion Tue, 07 Oct 2008 18:14:34 +0000 http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free#comment-5801 You're addressing two important things here. One is that some (and "some" counts a lot of them) resident's manners. It's not only with freebies, it's everywhere. I guess it's the same as it was in the first wave of web communities, when sense of anonymity and shelter behind the screen made some people behaving like they are living in the caves. That will pass. Etiquette will be formed and pressure of civilized society will do its way. But, how to react until then? Other is that people expect everything for free. That is a complicated one. Recently, when Rezzable introduced entrance fee for some of their sims voices raised. As far as I've heard, their traffic on those sims haven't fell, but still, protests were there. Those two adds up in a weird combination of residents running for free stuff (whether it be free clothes, entrance on sims or whatever) and being rude if they don't get what they want or simply don't like what they get. Accent here is on "running". What happened to the communication? What happened with meeting people and having fun time? Is that game outdated? Seems that for some it is. You’re addressing two important things here.

One is that some (and "some" counts a lot of them) resident’s manners. It’s not only with freebies, it’s everywhere. I guess it’s the same as it was in the first wave of web communities, when sense of anonymity and shelter behind the screen made some people behaving like they are living in the caves. That will pass. Etiquette will be formed and pressure of civilized society will do its way. But, how to react until then?

Other is that people expect everything for free. That is a complicated one. Recently, when Rezzable introduced entrance fee for some of their sims voices raised. As far as I’ve heard, their traffic on those sims haven’t fell, but still, protests were there.

Those two adds up in a weird combination of residents running for free stuff (whether it be free clothes, entrance on sims or whatever) and being rude if they don’t get what they want or simply don’t like what they get. Accent here is on "running". What happened to the communication? What happened with meeting people and having fun time? Is that game outdated? Seems that for some it is.

]]> By: Ghanima http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free/comment-page-2#comment-5800 Ghanima Tue, 07 Oct 2008 17:23:36 +0000 http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free#comment-5800 ok... first of all I want to say I am not against freebies in SL, I actually encourage the freebies thing giving many away to my clients. one thing is true though, and even the owners of freebie groups know it: no matter how generous we are, somehow more and more people each day keep acting like we owe them something, and treat us badly for it. One doesn't expect them to thank for every little freebie... but I guess answering a "hi" or at least not push you aside to get the freebie 2 seconds earlier wouldn't be to much of an effort. That attitude is not shared by everyone, there are people who are really educated and polite, but I see more and more designers each day leaving freebie groups for being treated badly by "clients" who think everything in sl should be for free. I say freebies are ok, but I also think it is OK to value our effort... stuff doesn't make itself, we work a lot on it. Whether we want to be paid for it or give it away as freebie, we are the ones to decide that. One of my best friends got burned in mainchat in front all f her clients because some freebie grabbers thought "her freebie was not good enough"... now that is harsh isn't it? THAT is definitely the kind of thought that will kill the freebie giving thing... not the thought of the person who made the original post I am commenting on. I think she is right thinking our work should be valued and I do not think the second readings on her post bent over the thought she is against freebies are right. If the post is read with a critic eye, instead of a "defensive" eye then you understand what she is saying PS: I tried to make my english as good as possible for this post, I apologize for any mistakes on it ok… first of all I want to say I am not against freebies in SL, I actually encourage the freebies thing giving many away to my clients. one thing is true though, and even the owners of freebie groups know it: no matter how generous we are, somehow more and more people each day keep acting like we owe them something, and treat us badly for it. One doesn’t expect them to thank for every little freebie… but I guess answering a "hi" or at least not push you aside to get the freebie 2 seconds earlier wouldn’t be to much of an effort. That attitude is not shared by everyone, there are people who are really educated and polite, but I see more and more designers each day leaving freebie groups for being treated badly by "clients" who think everything in sl should be for free. I say freebies are ok, but I also think it is OK to value our effort… stuff doesn’t make itself, we work a lot on it. Whether we want to be paid for it or give it away as freebie, we are the ones to decide that. One of my best friends got burned in mainchat in front all f her clients because some freebie grabbers thought "her freebie was not good enough"… now that is harsh isn’t it? THAT is definitely the kind of thought that will kill the freebie giving thing… not the thought of the person who made the original post I am commenting on. I think she is right thinking our work should be valued and I do not think the second readings on her post bent over the thought she is against freebies are right. If the post is read with a critic eye, instead of a "defensive" eye then you understand what she is saying

PS: I tried to make my english as good as possible for this post, I apologize for any mistakes on it

]]> By: dandellion http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free/comment-page-1#comment-5773 dandellion Sun, 28 Sep 2008 17:32:36 +0000 http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free#comment-5773 That is a much broader problem than it seems. As Wayne said, we lack any meaningful metrics. E.G. all I know about my parcel is some number representing traffic and a list of names who came since the last reset of the script in parcel greeter (that list is actually made to prevent spamming those that came back often). Compare that to all the data one can have for a web-site. So, most of our conclusions about what works for a parcel traffic and sales is mainly guessing. And then, it's not just offering freebies that will make any change. You can give a world for free in your little shop and nothing will happen if that offer isn't advertised well. That's where your blog and group do a terrific job. Please share some results when you do your survey. That is a much broader problem than it seems. As Wayne said, we lack any meaningful metrics. E.G. all I know about my parcel is some number representing traffic and a list of names who came since the last reset of the script in parcel greeter (that list is actually made to prevent spamming those that came back often). Compare that to all the data one can have for a web-site. So, most of our conclusions about what works for a parcel traffic and sales is mainly guessing.

And then, it’s not just offering freebies that will make any change. You can give a world for free in your little shop and nothing will happen if that offer isn’t advertised well. That’s where your blog and group do a terrific job. Please share some results when you do your survey.

]]> By: Creamy Cooljoke http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free/comment-page-1#comment-5771 Creamy Cooljoke Sat, 27 Sep 2008 17:05:46 +0000 http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free#comment-5771 This is a really tough one which i am torn about.  It would be interesting to know if the majority of people offering freebies are noticing an increase in sales of full price items because of the attraction of the free gift offered in store. I have a large group called Free*Style which has around 3 thousand people - many store owners and creators have joined the group so they can send notices of any free gifts they have to offer.   I have had some feedback from designers who have been over the moon and reported loads of sales after sending the notice, but not as many as I thought.   I think I may do a poll on my blog to see if it does actually increase sales for the majority of designers, I know it certainly introduces people to lesser known designers which is a good thing.    Many people are just in the game for fun and creativity so aren't really bothered about making money, but for those who make a living off SL I would be interested to know if freebie giving actually has any benefit to them :) This is a really tough one which i am torn about. 

It would be interesting to know if the majority of people offering freebies are noticing an increase in sales of full price items because of the attraction of the free gift offered in store.

I have a large group called Free*Style which has around 3 thousand people - many store owners and creators have joined the group so they can send notices of any free gifts they have to offer.   I have had some feedback from designers who have been over the moon and reported loads of sales after sending the notice, but not as many as I thought.   I think I may do a poll on my blog to see if it does actually increase sales for the majority of designers, I know it certainly introduces people to lesser known designers which is a good thing.   

Many people are just in the game for fun and creativity so aren’t really bothered about making money, but for those who make a living off SL I would be interested to know if freebie giving actually has any benefit to them :)

]]> By: Wayne Porter http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free/comment-page-1#comment-5026 Wayne Porter Sat, 22 Mar 2008 08:52:01 +0000 http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free#comment-5026 Was replying to Nikita- sorry. Google's AI is now powering search...and how it will alter behavior. IMHO it has already. Was replying to Nikita- sorry. Google’s AI is now powering search…and how it will alter behavior. IMHO it has already.

]]> By: Wayne Porter http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free/comment-page-1#comment-5024 Wayne Porter Sat, 22 Mar 2008 07:45:00 +0000 http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free#comment-5024 Prok, To me some of the obvious solutions are: a) homogenous systems for vending/partnerships- helps one scale in a world not meant to scale. b) keeping both Lindens and $ in play c) building in mechanisms that allow for scarcity of goods and guarantee they are authentic d) teaching scriptors/builders how to market- the most successful are usually e) As Prok notes (I give her props for really understanding attention = revenue) indoctrinating users beyond camping and get rich quick fantasies is important. f) lack of accountability has tainted the faith many had in the system. e.g. the banks, and stock markets, etc. g) lack of meaningful metrics. I am talking micro-metrics and these are hard to study because of the instability of the grid. There are solutions,but in the end, is a micro-transaction only model going to allow one to quit their day job? Highly unlikely for most and if you could would want all the concentration risk of LL- no matter how much I like the spirit of the platform? Diversity is important and quality is relative and probably the data, translated in a meaningful way- is worth more than some of the products. regards, Wayne (AKA Corwin Chevalier) Prok,

To me some of the obvious solutions are:

a) homogenous systems for vending/partnerships- helps one scale in a world not meant to scale.

b) keeping both Lindens and $ in play

c) building in mechanisms that allow for scarcity of goods and guarantee they are authentic

d) teaching scriptors/builders how to market- the most successful are usually

e) As Prok notes (I give her props for really understanding attention = revenue) indoctrinating users beyond camping and get rich quick fantasies is important.

f) lack of accountability has tainted the faith many had in the system. e.g. the banks, and stock markets, etc.

g) lack of meaningful metrics. I am talking micro-metrics and these are hard to study because of the instability of the grid.

There are solutions,but in the end, is a micro-transaction only model going to allow one to quit their day job? Highly unlikely for most and if you could would want all the concentration risk of LL- no matter how much I like the spirit of the platform?

Diversity is important and quality is relative and probably the data, translated in a meaningful way- is worth more than some of the products.

regards,
Wayne
(AKA Corwin Chevalier)

]]> By: dandellion http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free/comment-page-1#comment-5023 dandellion Sat, 22 Mar 2008 07:19:07 +0000 http://metaverse.acidzen.org/2008/to-free-or-not-to-free#comment-5023 I am not sure I understood the question. I am not sure I understood the question.

]]>